Comments on: I Swear http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/ Exposing the ugly truths about the Bush Administration. Mon, 13 Oct 2008 17:48:46 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=1.5.1.3 by: Doug Hughes http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60393 Sun, 24 Dec 2006 01:52:26 +0000 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60393 If I may be permitted to quote Thomas Jefferson... "But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my legs. If it be said, his testimony in a court cannot be relied on, reject it then, and be the stigma on him. Constraint may make him worse by making him a hypocrite, but it will never make him a truer man." Now I am reading into the intent here; you are free to take a different meaning if you wish. I read the word 'constraint' to mean forcing a non-christian to swear on the Bible, and if you read it that way.. a more powerful indication of the intent of the founding fathers would be hard to find. If I may be permitted to quote Thomas Jefferson…

“But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods, or no god. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my legs. If it be said, his testimony in a court cannot be relied on, reject it then, and be the stigma on him. Constraint may make him worse by making him a hypocrite, but it will never make him a truer man.”

Now I am reading into the intent here; you are free to take a different meaning if you wish. I read the word ‘constraint’ to mean forcing a non-christian to swear on the Bible, and if you read it that way.. a more powerful indication of the intent of the founding fathers would be hard to find.

]]> by: paradoctor http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60301 Sat, 23 Dec 2006 19:15:49 +0000 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60301 The funny thing is that swearing on the Bible is precisely what is meant by 'taking the name in vain'. So to swear on the Bible is to disobey it! The funny thing is that swearing on the Bible is precisely what is meant by ‘taking the name in vain’. So to swear on the Bible is to disobey it!

]]> by: maha http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60294 Sat, 23 Dec 2006 18:38:01 +0000 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60294 Brian et al. -- the more I think about it, the more it seems the judge of the "dumbest trial" (let's call him "Judge A" for brevity) is putting an unfair burden on people who don't want to swear on a Bible. If a witness enters the courtroom and is confronted (possibly to his surprise) with directions to swear on a Bible, and he doesn't want to, the burden is on him to object. Brian et al. — the more I think about it, the more it seems the judge of the “dumbest trial” (let’s call him “Judge A” for brevity) is putting an unfair burden on people who don’t want to swear on a Bible. If a witness enters the courtroom and is confronted (possibly to his surprise) with directions to swear on a Bible, and he doesn’t want to, the burden is on him to object.

]]> by: grannyeagle http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60292 Sat, 23 Dec 2006 18:23:40 +0000 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60292 Swami---Ahem! I believe it is the goddess of nature not god so it would be HER infallible word. Swami—Ahem! I believe it is the goddess of nature not god so it would be HER infallible word.

]]> by: Brian http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60281 Sat, 23 Dec 2006 17:47:50 +0000 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60281 Based on my experience, it's rare to have a witness swear on a Bible (shh, don't tell the wingnuts). In some courts, a clerk will hold a Bible in his left hand while asking the witness to swear, but the Bible will not be presented to the witness. The bigger problem you mention is an inability to distinguish right from left. Several times, when I've been a passenger giving directions, I've had to tell drivers to turn "my way" or turn "your way" because right and left would not register quickly enough to avoid missing a turn. These drivers were otherwise competent and intelligent people, so I don't know what causes this problem. Based on my experience, it’s rare to have a witness swear on a Bible (shh, don’t tell the wingnuts). In some courts, a clerk will hold a Bible in his left hand while asking the witness to swear, but the Bible will not be presented to the witness.

The bigger problem you mention is an inability to distinguish right from left. Several times, when I’ve been a passenger giving directions, I’ve had to tell drivers to turn “my way” or turn “your way” because right and left would not register quickly enough to avoid missing a turn. These drivers were otherwise competent and intelligent people, so I don’t know what causes this problem.

]]> by: joanr16 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60271 Sat, 23 Dec 2006 16:38:06 +0000 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60271 I'd probably swear on their stupid bible if I thought not doing so would make the jurors think I was lying. But if they wanted to hold me to something sacred, they'd be better off having me swear on the Complete Works of Shakespeare, or a copy of Margaret Atwood's <i>The Handmaid's Tale</i>, or a collection of Calvin and Hobbes cartoons. I’d probably swear on their stupid bible if I thought not doing so would make the jurors think I was lying. But if they wanted to hold me to something sacred, they’d be better off having me swear on the Complete Works of Shakespeare, or a copy of Margaret Atwood’s The Handmaid’s Tale, or a collection of Calvin and Hobbes cartoons.

]]> by: lou http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60210 Sat, 23 Dec 2006 13:39:18 +0000 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60210 Guess it beats, "Ok, see these two wires here? You tell us all you know about this jerk off or we'll wrap these wires around your testicles and turn up the current!" Probably wouldn't take long before you were swearing to god. Sometimes going along with the system doesn't mean you agree with it or defend it. Give them their symbols and they'll be none the wiser as you craft your real art. Guess it beats, “Ok, see these two wires here? You tell us all you know about this jerk off or we’ll wrap these wires around your testicles and turn up the current!” Probably wouldn’t take long before you were swearing to god. Sometimes going along with the system doesn’t mean you agree with it or defend it. Give them their symbols and they’ll be none the wiser as you craft your real art.

]]> by: cosette http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60145 Sat, 23 Dec 2006 11:35:09 +0000 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60145 I'm really beginning to hate anything that smacks of religion. And I think it's inappropriate to use a bible in a courtroom. Or any kind of religious book for swearing in to anything. I’m really beginning to hate anything that smacks of religion. And I think it’s inappropriate to use a bible in a courtroom. Or any kind of religious book for swearing in to anything.

]]> by: Donna http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60063 Sat, 23 Dec 2006 06:52:44 +0000 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60063 Last spring, I was subpoenaed to testify in court against my next door neighbor [what a bummer to have to testify..... I've always liked him and his wife as neighbors]. He was drunk and shot off a 44 magnum out his back yard at a tomato-stealing raccoon.....a felony offense to discharge a firearm within the city limits. 'Course, that loud gunshot woke up the town and he sobered up immediately when the police came. No Bibles in that courtroom. I just had to hold up my right hand and swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Being a leftie, I mean left-handed as well as a leftie, I wonder why I shouldn't hold up my dominant hand? Just kidding......but hey, this ritual is made up of established usages. I am glad that our courts leave a religion-based oath out of it. Last spring, I was subpoenaed to testify in court against my next door neighbor [what a bummer to have to testify….. I’ve always liked him and his wife as neighbors]. He was drunk and shot off a 44 magnum out his back yard at a tomato-stealing raccoon…..a felony offense to discharge a firearm within the city limits. ‘Course, that loud gunshot woke up the town and he sobered up immediately when the police came.

No Bibles in that courtroom. I just had to hold up my right hand and swear to tell the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Being a leftie, I mean left-handed as well as a leftie, I wonder why I shouldn’t hold up my dominant hand? Just kidding……but hey, this ritual is made up of established usages. I am glad that our courts leave a religion-based oath out of it.

]]> by: atablarasa http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60034 Sat, 23 Dec 2006 05:53:15 +0000 http://www.mahablog.com/2006/12/22/i-swear/#comment-60034 The jury does notice. Used to work in a courthouse and heard all kinds of jury polls. Still, they also hear the truth if it's offered well. The jury does notice. Used to work in a courthouse and heard all kinds of jury polls. Still, they also hear the truth if it’s offered well.

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