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	<title>Comments on: Stout-Hearted Men?</title>
	<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/</link>
	<description>Exposing the ugly truths about the Bush Administration.</description>
	<pubDate>Mon, 13 Oct 2008 17:55:11 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>by: maha</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-137296</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Mar 2007 18:31:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-137296</guid>
					<description>&lt;i&gt;Why is it whenever a man disagrees with a butch&lt;/i&gt;

Mr. Chapin is not a man, and I'm not a butch.

I will say again to whatever mouth-breathers and knuckle-draggers he chases over here -- I don't have a problem with men. I like men. What I hate is the faux masculinity -- actually a kind of perpetual adolescence -- that Mr. Chapin exemplifies. 

And, of course, you miss the whole point and assume that I dislike you because you are a man. No, I dislike you because you are NOT a man. 

A real adult, manly man is a rare and wondrous creature, and I wish there were more of them. Sorrowfully, you and Mr. Chapin don't count.

And now, comments are closed.

BTW -- You might learn something about where faux masculinity comes from in &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/07/flexible-lives/&quot;&gt;my new post&lt;/a&gt;. Please do not add comments to that post without reading it. Such comments will be deleted (see &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.mahablog.com/commenting-rules/&quot;&gt;commenting rules&lt;/a&gt;).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>Why is it whenever a man disagrees with a butch</i></p>
	<p>Mr. Chapin is not a man, and I&#8217;m not a butch.</p>
	<p>I will say again to whatever mouth-breathers and knuckle-draggers he chases over here &#8212; I don&#8217;t have a problem with men. I like men. What I hate is the faux masculinity &#8212; actually a kind of perpetual adolescence &#8212; that Mr. Chapin exemplifies. </p>
	<p>And, of course, you miss the whole point and assume that I dislike you because you are a man. No, I dislike you because you are NOT a man. </p>
	<p>A real adult, manly man is a rare and wondrous creature, and I wish there were more of them. Sorrowfully, you and Mr. Chapin don&#8217;t count.</p>
	<p>And now, comments are closed.</p>
	<p>BTW &#8212; You might learn something about where faux masculinity comes from in <a href="http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/07/flexible-lives/">my new post</a>. Please do not add comments to that post without reading it. Such comments will be deleted (see <a href="http://www.mahablog.com/commenting-rules/">commenting rules</a>).
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		<title>by: Superman</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-137136</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Mar 2007 17:25:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-137136</guid>
					<description>If for not Mr. Chapin’s logical posts in this thread, I would never consider being part of such pure stupidity.  If the feminist agenda was so right why for last 40 years has this country been sliding down the tubes.  Could it be because women can not do as good a job as a man?  Maybe that’s why they don’t get paid the same.  Maybe that’s why they are unable to run successful small businesses.  Could it be that feminism has destroyed the American family?  [&lt;em&gt;sentence deleted for being too raunchy for this blog -- maha&lt;/em&gt;]

Why is it whenever a man disagrees with a butch, that it is always some women from the past that has done him wrong.  And right, they should seek therapy from a profession that is all leftist morons.  You know, the ones that reversed the theory that homosexuality is a metal disorder.

[&lt;em&gt;Note: I started to delete that last sentence because it violates comment rules, but the misspelling of &quot;mental&quot; makes it rather cute. -- maha&lt;/em&gt;]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>If for not Mr. Chapin’s logical posts in this thread, I would never consider being part of such pure stupidity.  If the feminist agenda was so right why for last 40 years has this country been sliding down the tubes.  Could it be because women can not do as good a job as a man?  Maybe that’s why they don’t get paid the same.  Maybe that’s why they are unable to run successful small businesses.  Could it be that feminism has destroyed the American family?  [<em>sentence deleted for being too raunchy for this blog &#8212; maha</em>]</p>
	<p>Why is it whenever a man disagrees with a butch, that it is always some women from the past that has done him wrong.  And right, they should seek therapy from a profession that is all leftist morons.  You know, the ones that reversed the theory that homosexuality is a metal disorder.</p>
	<p>[<em>Note: I started to delete that last sentence because it violates comment rules, but the misspelling of &#8220;mental&#8221; makes it rather cute. &#8212; maha</em>]
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		<title>by: CAL</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-137033</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Mar 2007 16:40:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-137033</guid>
					<description>After reading this entire thread I made note of one huge misrepresentation of fact that demonstrates the springboard from which local (as in here on this site) thought derives is tainted.
The book Manliness correctly pointed out the characteristics needed to succeed and climb in corporate America, especially in very large public companies.
To wit, when reasonably intelligent adult men leave a seminar muttering the word &quot;change&quot; breathlessly as if the concept exists only in the LaPlacian domain of differential equations, indeed, that is not a sign of independent thinking and stand up character. What they are doing is laughable, and many of them know it. The language of corporate America has become nearly meaningless, speaking more words with little to no content, or recycling business self help principles that are no more than sexed up basic  common sense. Read Jack Welch's book and tell me it contains an original idea, a tangible actionable item, and a form of lone ranger agressiveness, or is it another jargon filled tome about recognizing change and embracing it?
&quot;Who Moved My Cheese&quot;....when men read that book with expectation that rivals a religionists study of scripture, there is a problem. No one will say yes or no anymore. We all facilitate, collaborate, caucus, and read and write emails. How in the world does anything real ever get done?
Sure, once a man is CEO, maybe then he can be agressive and single minded in his approach...in other words the way he is naturally, the way he REALLY is, but to get there he must suppress that side of himself and act very unmanly.
The effect of this is so incredibly subtle that people either gloss over disinterested, or they reject it as false. If you have never worked in an environment like I describe then you've never worked in a big company.
The flawed reasoning behind the rejection of Chapins positing of this truth flows (un)naturally into flawed analysis further on.

[&lt;em&gt;CAL -- I've worked for big corporation and have had to deal with real CEOs, not just middle managers. I stand by what I wrote. &lt;/em&gt;-- &lt;em&gt;maha&lt;/em&gt;]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>After reading this entire thread I made note of one huge misrepresentation of fact that demonstrates the springboard from which local (as in here on this site) thought derives is tainted.<br />
The book Manliness correctly pointed out the characteristics needed to succeed and climb in corporate America, especially in very large public companies.<br />
To wit, when reasonably intelligent adult men leave a seminar muttering the word &#8220;change&#8221; breathlessly as if the concept exists only in the LaPlacian domain of differential equations, indeed, that is not a sign of independent thinking and stand up character. What they are doing is laughable, and many of them know it. The language of corporate America has become nearly meaningless, speaking more words with little to no content, or recycling business self help principles that are no more than sexed up basic  common sense. Read Jack Welch&#8217;s book and tell me it contains an original idea, a tangible actionable item, and a form of lone ranger agressiveness, or is it another jargon filled tome about recognizing change and embracing it?<br />
&#8220;Who Moved My Cheese&#8221;&#8230;.when men read that book with expectation that rivals a religionists study of scripture, there is a problem. No one will say yes or no anymore. We all facilitate, collaborate, caucus, and read and write emails. How in the world does anything real ever get done?<br />
Sure, once a man is CEO, maybe then he can be agressive and single minded in his approach&#8230;in other words the way he is naturally, the way he REALLY is, but to get there he must suppress that side of himself and act very unmanly.<br />
The effect of this is so incredibly subtle that people either gloss over disinterested, or they reject it as false. If you have never worked in an environment like I describe then you&#8217;ve never worked in a big company.<br />
The flawed reasoning behind the rejection of Chapins positing of this truth flows (un)naturally into flawed analysis further on.</p>
	<p>[<em>CAL &#8212; I&#8217;ve worked for big corporation and have had to deal with real CEOs, not just middle managers. I stand by what I wrote. </em>&#8211; <em>maha</em>]
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		<title>by: moonbat</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-136007</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Mar 2007 08:13:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-136007</guid>
					<description>It's high time a public figure on our side called out the weenies on the other side and their phony macho for what it is. Articles like this and Glenn's help get to the bottom of it.

Fortunately or unfortunately, this will likely take someone whose real masculinity is beyond question, such as a Wes Clark or a Jim Webb. Or even a Bill Maher or Tim Robbins who sometimes has the guts, if not a recognizable record of achievement in the real world. It could well be someone from the entertainment world who first says what's been written here, in much the way that Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert broke the ice by making it &quot;safe&quot; to joke at Bush and wingnuttia. They led with humor, giving voice to what so many of us were horrified at inside.

Sadly, Edwards only reacted to the surface message - about faggots - by condemning it, and preaching a message of inclusion. Necessary, but as you and Glenn so aptly point out, this is not what Ann Coulter is about, and even she admitted as much. Edwards' message dances to Ann's game, and does nothing to disarm her.

What's needed is a knock out blow. When one of our public figures can speak to this pathetic need for a father figure while citing all the immature behavior on the world stage that's the result of this childish longing, speaking directly to the sickness within people like Ann Coulter and others, that's when the right will be seen for the hollow weenies that they truly are. That's when our side will see a long overdue measure of respect. It will only happen when we have the guts and insight to call a spade a spade, in such a way that anybody whose eyes aren't blind can see.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>It&#8217;s high time a public figure on our side called out the weenies on the other side and their phony macho for what it is. Articles like this and Glenn&#8217;s help get to the bottom of it.</p>
	<p>Fortunately or unfortunately, this will likely take someone whose real masculinity is beyond question, such as a Wes Clark or a Jim Webb. Or even a Bill Maher or Tim Robbins who sometimes has the guts, if not a recognizable record of achievement in the real world. It could well be someone from the entertainment world who first says what&#8217;s been written here, in much the way that Jon Stewart and Stephen Colbert broke the ice by making it &#8220;safe&#8221; to joke at Bush and wingnuttia. They led with humor, giving voice to what so many of us were horrified at inside.</p>
	<p>Sadly, Edwards only reacted to the surface message - about faggots - by condemning it, and preaching a message of inclusion. Necessary, but as you and Glenn so aptly point out, this is not what Ann Coulter is about, and even she admitted as much. Edwards&#8217; message dances to Ann&#8217;s game, and does nothing to disarm her.</p>
	<p>What&#8217;s needed is a knock out blow. When one of our public figures can speak to this pathetic need for a father figure while citing all the immature behavior on the world stage that&#8217;s the result of this childish longing, speaking directly to the sickness within people like Ann Coulter and others, that&#8217;s when the right will be seen for the hollow weenies that they truly are. That&#8217;s when our side will see a long overdue measure of respect. It will only happen when we have the guts and insight to call a spade a spade, in such a way that anybody whose eyes aren&#8217;t blind can see.
</p>
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		<title>by: justme</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-135297</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Mar 2007 03:08:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-135297</guid>
					<description>Bc, I hardly see how asking a question makes me a chauvinist. I am shocked to learn men are so terrified of women.Not being a male the question was a reasonable one considering I would have no understanding of what it is like to be a poor, threatened,afraid male.

Men and women are equals???Well talk to me when you can squeeze an 8 pound child out of your penis about being equal.Talk to me when YOU stand up for equal pay for women for an equal days work...talk to me when women can go home and sit on their asses at night instead of their days just starting when they get off work and we will talk about equal.Talk to me about being equal when the number of males who are victims of spouse abuse or death at the hands of a spouse is anywhere near equal.See, what you are giving me is lip service about us being equal...not equality.And you want to whine here about how you are threatened by women?SAD INDEED.If we are equal when the hell do men intend to let society reflect that?You equality seems to be very selective at best.One could consider that chauvinistic but unlike you I don't need to call you a chauvinist,,, your words do it for me.
 It was amusing how you claimed you wouldn't call names then you labeled me a chauvinist....WOW....you can't even be honest for one paragraph...you shouldn't write a book.Instead you should read some.
  I am so so so sorry some evil women lied against you in your past and that you have had some bad experiences but standing up for yourself  didn't change what happened to you...and since you still are carrying it like baggage it didn't help you move on either.Please seek help and try not to spread your illness to others. But thanks for educating us on what is wrong with the angry white male.It is a shocking look inside the minds of frightened males.To a therapist you are a summer home in the hamptons...gotta love it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Bc, I hardly see how asking a question makes me a chauvinist. I am shocked to learn men are so terrified of women.Not being a male the question was a reasonable one considering I would have no understanding of what it is like to be a poor, threatened,afraid male.</p>
	<p>Men and women are equals???Well talk to me when you can squeeze an 8 pound child out of your penis about being equal.Talk to me when YOU stand up for equal pay for women for an equal days work&#8230;talk to me when women can go home and sit on their asses at night instead of their days just starting when they get off work and we will talk about equal.Talk to me about being equal when the number of males who are victims of spouse abuse or death at the hands of a spouse is anywhere near equal.See, what you are giving me is lip service about us being equal&#8230;not equality.And you want to whine here about how you are threatened by women?SAD INDEED.If we are equal when the hell do men intend to let society reflect that?You equality seems to be very selective at best.One could consider that chauvinistic but unlike you I don&#8217;t need to call you a chauvinist,,, your words do it for me.<br />
 It was amusing how you claimed you wouldn&#8217;t call names then you labeled me a chauvinist&#8230;.WOW&#8230;.you can&#8217;t even be honest for one paragraph&#8230;you shouldn&#8217;t write a book.Instead you should read some.<br />
  I am so so so sorry some evil women lied against you in your past and that you have had some bad experiences but standing up for yourself  didn&#8217;t change what happened to you&#8230;and since you still are carrying it like baggage it didn&#8217;t help you move on either.Please seek help and try not to spread your illness to others. But thanks for educating us on what is wrong with the angry white male.It is a shocking look inside the minds of frightened males.To a therapist you are a summer home in the hamptons&#8230;gotta love it.
</p>
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		<title>by: Swami</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-135225</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Mar 2007 02:37:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-135225</guid>
					<description>Reading Bchapin's little dissertation on being a &quot;manly man&quot;reminds me of a skit that John Belushi did on Saturday Night Live many years ago called &lt;i&gt;Miles Coppethwaite&lt;/i&gt;. In the skit, Belishi was a lascivious sea captain who wanted to comfort his cabin boy, and mentor him to become a &quot;manly man&quot;. Michael Pailin played the cabin boy who tried to ward off the captain's advances with a naive and innocent reply of.. but,I don't need comforting, Captain.

For me, the term, &quot;manly man&quot; equates to a code word for buggery.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Reading Bchapin&#8217;s little dissertation on being a &#8220;manly man&#8221;reminds me of a skit that John Belushi did on Saturday Night Live many years ago called <i>Miles Coppethwaite</i>. In the skit, Belishi was a lascivious sea captain who wanted to comfort his cabin boy, and mentor him to become a &#8220;manly man&#8221;. Michael Pailin played the cabin boy who tried to ward off the captain&#8217;s advances with a naive and innocent reply of.. but,I don&#8217;t need comforting, Captain.</p>
	<p>For me, the term, &#8220;manly man&#8221; equates to a code word for buggery.
</p>
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		<title>by: maha</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-135086</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Mar 2007 01:38:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-135086</guid>
					<description>&lt;i&gt;So then, being a man means being a submissive?&lt;/i&gt;

Real men are neither dominant nor submissive.

&lt;i&gt;That’s the crux of the matter as I, nor anyone I no of, runs around attacking women either verbally or physically.&lt;/i&gt;

Everything you write is one long howl of adolescent rage and fear and resentment of women. I'm sorry you are so screwed up, but I have no patience with it. Get therapy, and go away.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>So then, being a man means being a submissive?</i></p>
	<p>Real men are neither dominant nor submissive.</p>
	<p><i>That’s the crux of the matter as I, nor anyone I no of, runs around attacking women either verbally or physically.</i></p>
	<p>Everything you write is one long howl of adolescent rage and fear and resentment of women. I&#8217;m sorry you are so screwed up, but I have no patience with it. Get therapy, and go away.
</p>
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		<title>by: Lynne</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-135052</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Mar 2007 01:25:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-135052</guid>
					<description>Well, I am silly to get into this right here, but when I was growing up,- 50 or so years ago,  - we were all taught, boys and girls, that we were to ignore people who called us names, that response to such behavior was unworthy of us.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Well, I am silly to get into this right here, but when I was growing up,- 50 or so years ago,  - we were all taught, boys and girls, that we were to ignore people who called us names, that response to such behavior was unworthy of us.
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		<title>by: Bchapin</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-135018</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Mar 2007 01:10:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-135018</guid>
					<description>Nobody sniveling here, just good logical arguments. I have no desire to call any of you names. Radical feminism has been attacking men for 40 years, but radical feminists are but a hypersmall minority of women on the whole. 

&quot;Wow…do men really find woman so threatening that there is a need to defend ones self?&quot; These are the words of a chauvinist. Men and women are equals, and both sexes should always defend themselves when they are attacked. Your comment would make sense only if men were somehow superior and above women which we certainly are not in this country.  

&quot;Oh, and grow up and be a man.&quot; So then, being a man means being a submissive? Is that what being a man means? Letting others lie about you as you smile obliviously? That's silly but these comments do help me with my work so I appreciate the imput. 

What exactly is your position? If a woman says something about a man then it is your belief that the man should say nothing in his own defense? That's the crux of the matter as I, nor anyone I no of, runs around attacking women either verbally or physically. Why would this be because we evolved with one sex to play the serf and the other to play the feudal master? 

I think the world will be a better place when both men and women stand up for themselves whenever they are demeaned or insulted.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Nobody sniveling here, just good logical arguments. I have no desire to call any of you names. Radical feminism has been attacking men for 40 years, but radical feminists are but a hypersmall minority of women on the whole. </p>
	<p>&#8220;Wow…do men really find woman so threatening that there is a need to defend ones self?&#8221; These are the words of a chauvinist. Men and women are equals, and both sexes should always defend themselves when they are attacked. Your comment would make sense only if men were somehow superior and above women which we certainly are not in this country.  </p>
	<p>&#8220;Oh, and grow up and be a man.&#8221; So then, being a man means being a submissive? Is that what being a man means? Letting others lie about you as you smile obliviously? That&#8217;s silly but these comments do help me with my work so I appreciate the imput. </p>
	<p>What exactly is your position? If a woman says something about a man then it is your belief that the man should say nothing in his own defense? That&#8217;s the crux of the matter as I, nor anyone I no of, runs around attacking women either verbally or physically. Why would this be because we evolved with one sex to play the serf and the other to play the feudal master? </p>
	<p>I think the world will be a better place when both men and women stand up for themselves whenever they are demeaned or insulted.
</p>
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		<title>by: maha</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-134979</link>
		<pubDate>Wed, 07 Mar 2007 00:51:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/03/06/stout-hearted-men/#comment-134979</guid>
					<description>Bchapin -- Keep sniveling, son. I know good and well where you are coming from. Alas, the woods are full of weenies like you. 

&quot;My genitalia does not make me your inferior.&quot;

I never said it did. Learn to read. Oh, and grow up and be a man. I like men who are, you know, men.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Bchapin &#8212; Keep sniveling, son. I know good and well where you are coming from. Alas, the woods are full of weenies like you. </p>
	<p>&#8220;My genitalia does not make me your inferior.&#8221;</p>
	<p>I never said it did. Learn to read. Oh, and grow up and be a man. I like men who are, you know, men.
</p>
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