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	<title>Comments on: He Knew</title>
	<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/</link>
	<description>Exposing the ugly truths about the Bush Administration.</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 21 Nov 2008 11:10:45 +0000</pubDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=1.5.1.3</generator>

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		<title>by: Steve from Canuckistan</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278707</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Sep 2007 19:09:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278707</guid>
					<description>It's sad that a democratically controlled Congress will not do more to take Bush's war-making powers away before be commits the unthinkable in Iran. I imagine that future historians will judge the miscreants in both parties harshly.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>It&#8217;s sad that a democratically controlled Congress will not do more to take Bush&#8217;s war-making powers away before be commits the unthinkable in Iran. I imagine that future historians will judge the miscreants in both parties harshly.
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		<title>by: r4d20</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278676</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Sep 2007 16:35:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278676</guid>
					<description>For balance, however, I should say that we CAN blame Bush for refusing to listen to the &lt;i&gt;independent&lt;/i&gt; sources that confirmed the information coming from the Iraqi FM.

1) &lt;i&gt;But the CIA officers working on the Sabri case kept collecting information. &quot;We checked on everything he told us.&quot; French intelligence eavesdropped on his telephone conversations and shared them with the CIA. These taps &quot;validated&quot; Sabri's claims, according to one of the CIA officers. The officers brought this material to the attention of the newly formed Iraqi Operations Group within the CIA. But those in charge of the IOG were on a mission to prove that Saddam did have WMD and would not give credit to anything that came from the French. &quot;They kept saying the French were trying to undermine the war,&quot; said one of the CIA officers.

The officers continued to insist on the significance of Sabri's information, but one of Tenet's deputies told them, &quot;You haven't figured this out yet. This isn't about intelligence. It's about regime change.&quot;&lt;/i&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>For balance, however, I should say that we CAN blame Bush for refusing to listen to the <i>independent</i> sources that confirmed the information coming from the Iraqi FM.</p>
	<p>1) <i>But the CIA officers working on the Sabri case kept collecting information. &#8220;We checked on everything he told us.&#8221; French intelligence eavesdropped on his telephone conversations and shared them with the CIA. These taps &#8220;validated&#8221; Sabri&#8217;s claims, according to one of the CIA officers. The officers brought this material to the attention of the newly formed Iraqi Operations Group within the CIA. But those in charge of the IOG were on a mission to prove that Saddam did have WMD and would not give credit to anything that came from the French. &#8220;They kept saying the French were trying to undermine the war,&#8221; said one of the CIA officers.</p>
	<p>The officers continued to insist on the significance of Sabri&#8217;s information, but one of Tenet&#8217;s deputies told them, &#8220;You haven&#8217;t figured this out yet. This isn&#8217;t about intelligence. It&#8217;s about regime change.&#8221;</i>
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		<title>by: r4d20</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278672</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Sep 2007 16:27:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278672</guid>
					<description>Maha, 

Im not sure this is entirely &quot;fair&quot;.  

The article says &quot;Bush dismissed as worthless this information from the Iraqi foreign minister&quot;.

I'm not arguing with the fact that Bush is a stubborn, ignorant man who sticks to his opinions even in the face of evidence to the contrary.  He is.

Still, I cannot blame Bush for refusing to take the word of the Iraqi foreign minister at face value - especially when he is saying something that he could be expected to say regardless of the truth.

If the  relative of a criminal defendent told the prosecutor &quot;He's innocent&quot; before the trial and then he is indeed acquitted, would it be fair to say &quot;the prosecutor knew he was innocent all along&quot;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Maha, </p>
	<p>Im not sure this is entirely &#8220;fair&#8221;.  </p>
	<p>The article says &#8220;Bush dismissed as worthless this information from the Iraqi foreign minister&#8221;.</p>
	<p>I&#8217;m not arguing with the fact that Bush is a stubborn, ignorant man who sticks to his opinions even in the face of evidence to the contrary.  He is.</p>
	<p>Still, I cannot blame Bush for refusing to take the word of the Iraqi foreign minister at face value - especially when he is saying something that he could be expected to say regardless of the truth.</p>
	<p>If the  relative of a criminal defendent told the prosecutor &#8220;He&#8217;s innocent&#8221; before the trial and then he is indeed acquitted, would it be fair to say &#8220;the prosecutor knew he was innocent all along&#8221;?
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		<title>by: Brantl</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278669</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Sep 2007 16:22:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278669</guid>
					<description>THis is a stunning indichtment of Tenet, as well.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>THis is a stunning indichtment of Tenet, as well.
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		<title>by: Daryl</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278658</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Sep 2007 16:08:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278658</guid>
					<description>maha:

Thanks for that. It didn't help matters that no Senate Dem asked Tenet to be more specific. If they had, they would have been able to cut Bush off at the kneecaps.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>maha:</p>
	<p>Thanks for that. It didn&#8217;t help matters that no Senate Dem asked Tenet to be more specific. If they had, they would have been able to cut Bush off at the kneecaps.
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		<title>by: Chief</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278614</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Sep 2007 13:05:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278614</guid>
					<description>Nancy, 

Exactly what is off the table and, uh, why ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>Nancy, </p>
	<p>Exactly what is off the table and, uh, why ?
</p>
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		<title>by: paradoctor</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278538</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Sep 2007 05:51:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278538</guid>
					<description>We knew that the war was based on deception; this documents it. Facts were fixed around the policy. Either he deceived others and is a crook; or he deceived himself and is a fool; and in neither case should remain in power.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>We knew that the war was based on deception; this documents it. Facts were fixed around the policy. Either he deceived others and is a crook; or he deceived himself and is a fool; and in neither case should remain in power.
</p>
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		<title>by: erinyes</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278428</link>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Sep 2007 01:22:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278428</guid>
					<description>It's the Charlie Manson meets J.R.Ewing thing, a psychopathic narcissist with a flag-wrapped cross.( and a powerful army supported by a dumbed down very frightened  duct tape / visqueen buying general population)
In the words of Steve Irwin, &quot;Danger, danger, danger!&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p>It&#8217;s the Charlie Manson meets J.R.Ewing thing, a psychopathic narcissist with a flag-wrapped cross.( and a powerful army supported by a dumbed down very frightened  duct tape / visqueen buying general population)<br />
In the words of Steve Irwin, &#8220;Danger, danger, danger!&#8221;
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		<title>by: maha</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278366</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 20:28:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278366</guid>
					<description>&lt;i&gt;If you sincerely believe your delusions are real are you telling the truth?&lt;/i&gt;

You'd be lying to yourself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>If you sincerely believe your delusions are real are you telling the truth?</i></p>
	<p>You&#8217;d be lying to yourself.
</p>
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		<title>by: maha</title>
		<link>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278364</link>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Sep 2007 20:24:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid>http://www.mahablog.com/2007/09/06/he-knew/#comment-278364</guid>
					<description>&lt;i&gt;Didn’t Tenet go before them in October of 2002 and say Sadaam was no threat unless you attacked him?&lt;/i&gt;

That's not the same thing as saying he had no WMDs, and the White House immediately put out the spin that Saddam would sell his WMDs to terrorists. &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/10/20021009-3.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;See this press briefing from October 2002, with Ari Fleischer&lt;/a&gt;.

 &lt;blockquote&gt;Q Ari, one thing the President did not say was what Secretary Tenet said -- Director Tenet said in that letter, and that is that Saddam has drawn a line against weapons of mass destruction, and there's a low probability that he will use them unless he sees a threat coming from the U.S., unless he is cornered. Does the President agree with that assessment, or not?

MR. FLEISCHER: Well, the President, of course, has this information from the CIA and uses this in all his analysis, and he has no quarrels with what he has received from the CIA. It goes into the full context of all the information he receives about the threat that Saddam Hussein poses, and the threat that he presents. And the point that I make to you on that is that, when you talk about the probabilities, as the President said in his own speech last night, or two nights ago, he said, &quot;We can wait and hope that Saddam does not give weapons to terrorists or develop a nuclear weapon to blackmail the world, but I am convinced that that is a hope against all evidence. As Americans, we want peace, we work and sacrifice for peace. But there can be no peace if our security depends on the will and whims of a ruthless and aggressive dictator.&quot;

And that's the problem, Ron, that this issue presents -- that the only person who has sure knowledge of whether Saddam Hussein will use those weapons is Saddam Hussein. And you have to be aware of the fact that to suggest that as a result of unknowns, the President cannot defend the American people -- that relies on us trusting Saddam Hussein, and being willing to say that since Saddam Hussein is the only one who knows whether he'll use those weapons, we can't act or should not act, because we'll rely on his will and whim.

Q So even though in one part of the CIA Director's memo, where he clearly says there's a low probability that Saddam will strike unless he's cornered, the President, as he says in the speech, believes he's not going to risk one life on Saddam Hussein's word?

MR. FLEISCHER: Well, I think -- you also have to report what the rest of the statement was from the Director, because it wasn't just that truncated part of it. It was, in full fashion, the Director of the CIA had more to say than that. He went on to say that &quot;there is no question that the likelihood of Saddam using WMD&quot; -- weapons of mass destruction -- &quot;against the United States and its allies in the region for blackmail, deterrence, or otherwise, rose as he continues to build his arsenal. His past use of WMD against civilian and military targets shows that he produces those weapons to use, and not just deter.&quot;

So that's the full context of what the Director said. And let me put it to you this way: Another way to look at this is if Saddam Hussein holds a gun to your head even while he denies that he actually owns a gun, how safe should you feel? &lt;/blockquote&gt;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[	<p><i>Didn’t Tenet go before them in October of 2002 and say Sadaam was no threat unless you attacked him?</i></p>
	<p>That&#8217;s not the same thing as saying he had no WMDs, and the White House immediately put out the spin that Saddam would sell his WMDs to terrorists. <a href="http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/10/20021009-3.html" rel="nofollow">See this press briefing from October 2002, with Ari Fleischer</a>.</p>
	<blockquote><p>Q Ari, one thing the President did not say was what Secretary Tenet said &#8212; Director Tenet said in that letter, and that is that Saddam has drawn a line against weapons of mass destruction, and there&#8217;s a low probability that he will use them unless he sees a threat coming from the U.S., unless he is cornered. Does the President agree with that assessment, or not?</p>
	<p>MR. FLEISCHER: Well, the President, of course, has this information from the CIA and uses this in all his analysis, and he has no quarrels with what he has received from the CIA. It goes into the full context of all the information he receives about the threat that Saddam Hussein poses, and the threat that he presents. And the point that I make to you on that is that, when you talk about the probabilities, as the President said in his own speech last night, or two nights ago, he said, &#8220;We can wait and hope that Saddam does not give weapons to terrorists or develop a nuclear weapon to blackmail the world, but I am convinced that that is a hope against all evidence. As Americans, we want peace, we work and sacrifice for peace. But there can be no peace if our security depends on the will and whims of a ruthless and aggressive dictator.&#8221;</p>
	<p>And that&#8217;s the problem, Ron, that this issue presents &#8212; that the only person who has sure knowledge of whether Saddam Hussein will use those weapons is Saddam Hussein. And you have to be aware of the fact that to suggest that as a result of unknowns, the President cannot defend the American people &#8212; that relies on us trusting Saddam Hussein, and being willing to say that since Saddam Hussein is the only one who knows whether he&#8217;ll use those weapons, we can&#8217;t act or should not act, because we&#8217;ll rely on his will and whim.</p>
	<p>Q So even though in one part of the CIA Director&#8217;s memo, where he clearly says there&#8217;s a low probability that Saddam will strike unless he&#8217;s cornered, the President, as he says in the speech, believes he&#8217;s not going to risk one life on Saddam Hussein&#8217;s word?</p>
	<p>MR. FLEISCHER: Well, I think &#8212; you also have to report what the rest of the statement was from the Director, because it wasn&#8217;t just that truncated part of it. It was, in full fashion, the Director of the CIA had more to say than that. He went on to say that &#8220;there is no question that the likelihood of Saddam using WMD&#8221; &#8212; weapons of mass destruction &#8212; &#8220;against the United States and its allies in the region for blackmail, deterrence, or otherwise, rose as he continues to build his arsenal. His past use of WMD against civilian and military targets shows that he produces those weapons to use, and not just deter.&#8221;</p>
	<p>So that&#8217;s the full context of what the Director said. And let me put it to you this way: Another way to look at this is if Saddam Hussein holds a gun to your head even while he denies that he actually owns a gun, how safe should you feel? </p></blockquote>
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