33 thoughts on “Tough Choices”

1. There’s gonna be a fight! (Isn’t there?)
   Obama v. Republicans.
   Obama v. Catfood Commission.
   Obama v. Bush Tax Cuts.
   Everybody back off!
   There’s gonna be a gun fight at the DC Corral!
   Here comes our President. And, OMG, look what he’s brought to this gunfight! It’s a, a ‘spork!?!’
   Please, someone, assure me again that this is another example of 11th Dimensional Chess our master is playing. I’m kinda, sorta, more rapidly loosin’ some of that hopey, changey feeling thing I had a couple of years back…

   Uhm, it’s almost Christmas. If someone’s written a book called “Politics for Dummies,” I’d suggest a gift for every Democratic politician in this country. And especially one for our President.

   Here’s a place you can start:
   While it may be true that you ‘campaign in poetry, but govern in prose,’ how about not starting a negotiation as a subordinate, but as an independent clause?

2. However dismayed we may be by our multitude of afflictions, we must not acquiesce to the avarice of the wealthy and their wishful-thinking, Stockholm-syndrome followers.

   I am amazed Obama failed to make an effort or even an effective show on this. I know, I know: I shouldn’t be. It is really just a continuation of his past behavior, and past behavior is the best indicator of future actions. But really! This was a great opportunity to force the hands of the Republicans on admitting their real plans, beyond the campaign talking points of vague, minor cuts.

   I think I’m going to go take the bumper sticker off today.

3. By all means ballance the budget on the backs of the poor and elderly.

4. Were the past election not so much of a bloodbath, do you think that this would play out any differently? Beyond feeding some sort of “republican resurgence!” narrative, I don’t think that this would have played out much differently had it been on the slate last year.

   • Were the past election not so much of a bloodbath, do you think that this would play out any differently?

     The point is that President Obama may be assuming that he can’t count on progressive votes in 2012, so he’s going to have to cater to right-swinging independents who might be persuaded to swing in his direction if he doesn’t get too liberal. Hence, the message he may have gotten is that he has to move right. I think that’s the wrong message, politically as well as practically, but I fear that’s how he’s interpreting things.

5. Also, I’m not sure what the slam on the “base not coming out to vote” has to do with anything here (especially given my feelings in the last post). Indeed, we might have cut down on our losses had more democrats come out, but the structural factors were always pointing to at least a minor bloodbath (poor economy, high unemployment, first presidential midterm, democrats had picked up about every even marginally competitive district in the past 2 cycles…), but it wasn’t like our large majorities were somehow useful on issues like this. Were it just a matter of blocking this, we have the votes now. republicans can’t pass a thing without democrats, and indeed if it’s not extended, all of the unaffordable tax cuts expire.

   If we were smart, we’d let republicans hold their collective breath, let them all expire, blame the republicans for the tax increases on the middle class, and then boast about how much improvement we’ve made on the deficit in 2 years.

6. I said it yesterday, I’ll say it today and forever:

   Seriously? If they were serious and balanced, they’d be talking about moving the marginal tax rate to where it was when Ike was Prez. And they’d take every one of those Wall Street Billionaires.

   And they’d recommend closing loop holes that allow a corp like Exxon to have a net profit of $23 billion and not only pay no takes but get a gov’t payment of $156 million.

   Anybody that makes more that $5 million should be taxed at 90% for all over $5 mil.

   That goes for all those high paid ball players, like A-Rod and Manning and TV people like KO and Beck.

7. Not to minimize the plutocratic slant of this proposal, but one of the proposed hits against corporations is that they would no longer be able to deduct the cost of health insurance provided to their employees. Of course this hit would likely cascade to employees, as companies would cut back (further) on this benefit. Trying to see it positively, this could be one step toward decoupling health insurance from employment, but I doubt if that’s what the commission had in mind.

   • but one of the proposed hits against corporations is that they would no longer be able to deduct the cost of health insurance provided to their employees.

     The Right-wing think tanks have been pushing that idea for a while, as a first step toward ending employee benefit insurance and herding everyone into the individual private market. As I remember John McCain proposed that in his platform in 2008.

8. Maha, Obama is to the right of Clinton and Eisenhower–always was and always will be. He has always figured that he can keep the left in his pocket because what choice does the left have? Well he found out in the midterms when the left stayed home and kept their wallets shut and the idea of trying to track right sure did not work for the Blue Dog caucus. A lot of people are suggesting a challenge from the left in the primaries in 2012 and while that is appealing and may keep Obama out of office, it is not going to help the cause after 2012 and is unlikely to do much to move Obama before then. The guy is truly dangerous to all but the super rich and whatever hopes I had that this was some super smart strategy are long gone. What I think the left has to do is team up with the Tea partiers and get Obama impeached. I am not sure that being a lying sack of crap is a high crime or misdemeanor, but the tea partiers would jump at the chance and f Obama was removed from office, I would take my chances with Biden until 2012 and perhaps beyond. No thinking person on either side of the ideological battle can stomach the guy and we are failing as a country

   • Obama is to the right of Clinton and Eisenhower–always was and always will be.

     Ignorant hyperbole. Obama and Clinton (Bill and Hillary) are close to identical on nearly every issue, social and economic; Eisenhower was so long ago that comparisons are kind of meaningless. The only real difference between Obama and the Clintons are tactical, and as much as we all might have wished Obama had fought harder, I am certain a President Hillary Clinton would have caved even more. That has been her long established pattern.

     And I’m sure that if Hillary Clinton were president now, you’d be writing me about what a failure she is and how we need to nominate someone else for 2012, like maybe that Senator Barack Obama. Yawn. I’m too old for this.

     I can’t respect any argument that begins with such an obvious bias, and I didn’t read further. However, I’m sure you can find some nice Kucinich supporters somewhere who will listen to you.

9. moonbat – If health care benefits were taxable income, employees would be paying $126 billion/year more in income taxes. By way of the back door, employer provided health care is a $126 billion/year government health insurance system. And, of course, employers would no longer have the deduction, but would employees? Probably not.

   Our trajectory into a two-class country, the obscenely rich and the poverty stricken – 2% vs the other 98% – has gone from a crawl to a 2 minute mile. Two years ago one in five children lived in poverty. Today, it’s one in four. Our infant mortality is 24th in the world. The quality of our health care is 37th in the world.

   Children in poverty results in a crippling of their natural capacities. Spirits and minds are irrevocably stunted almost from birth. Will we be surprised when our childrens’, compared to other children in the world, test scores are in the tank? Probably not. We’ll mark it off as a failure of our education system.

   As I’ve said elsewhere today: Jefferson said, “I sincerely believe that banking establishments are more dangerous than standing armies.” 100 years later, Mark Twain said, “America has only one criminal class and it’s Congress.” 100 years later, the two have joined forces. The country is now being ruled by a, perhaps unstoppable, crime syndicate. And just recently Justice, our one last hope, has chosen to aid and abet the syndicate through the Citizens United decision.

10. Okay. So you think that cutting taxes for rich people, pushing health care reform which leaves insurance companies in the gravy train, appointing a Catfood Commission and stocking it with wealthy conservatives who publicly announced their antipathy toward social security is more liberal than Bill Clinton? Do you think continuing and accelerating inherited wars and basically expanding the military industrial complex is more liberal than Ike? If so then you have just established that Obama is more incompetent than Carter. It may escape your attention but Obama talks one game and has repeatedly done another. I thought liberals were better educated and smarter than the Christian Right which kept supporting the GOP who would talk ad nauseum about being anti abortion and moral values and when elected did precious little to match rhetoric to action, but I guess I was mistaken. I describe myself as in the middle, but it is hard to stand by and watch quietly while a guy tells people he is for the middle class and then do nothing but surrender to corporate interests. Any idea what corporate profits have been like since 2008? Any idea what has happened to income inequality in this country since 2008? I could mention the increase in the rate of poverty, the continued decline in educational attainment, the growing hoplessness of people of color, but the lousy economy would be the answer for that. Not so record corporate profits and record income inequality. So blow me off, but do not suggest that the facts are not there and if you do not want to besmirch the name of Saint Barry so be it, but then do not whine about people not voting Democratic. Your dear leader gave them no reason to.

    • Okay. So you think that cutting taxes for rich people, pushing health care reform which leaves insurance companies in the gravy train, appointing a Catfood Commission and stocking it with wealthy conservatives who publicly announced their antipathy toward social security is more liberal than Bill Clinton?

      Jeez, learn to read. I didn’t say Obama was MORE liberal than Bill Clinton; I said they were nearly identical. And all of the things you list are out of Clinton’s triangulation playbook. Bill was famous for moving right and taking over the Right’s pet issues, which was smart politics at the time but often bad governance.

      You are obviously more interested in stirring up hysteria than in calm, reasoned, and fact-base analysis, so why don’t go you hang out on Democratic Underground where you can find other one-dimensional thinkers to get hysterical with? There’s a lad.

11. Kevin Drum makes a good point. The only, the ONLY way to ever get spending under control–and in the long run it DOES need to be under control–is to reduce how much we spend on healthcare. The problem is that healthcare continues to go up a lot in both demand and price.

    Now obviously one solution is to just end the programs and then allow emergency rooms to turn people away so they can die in the street. I’m not into that solution. Reading a long series on just how much our healthcare costs and how much other countries pay we see a number of reasons. But even assuming all the cost cutting measures could be imposed by fiat and here I’m talking about cutting the salaries of over paid doctors and nurses (8% and 3% respectively) as well a denying high end experimental treatments, etc. it’s still not going to be enough. That requires raising taxes as well.

12. Hi Maha,

    I certainly think that conventional wisdom will fall in line with the “democrats were repudiated for being too liberal…” narrative since that’s essentially a reflex at this point (and is useful to the ownership class). I further believe that anyone who does politics professionally would certainly know that Democrats were going to lose a bucketload of seats in this cycle just given the fundamentals of the state of the economy, that after the last two cycles democrats held just about any marginally competitive house seat, and where in the electoral cycle we were (first midterm).

    So, if one listens to conventional wisdom, then it was essentially certain that the story at this point would be that “Dems have to move to the right…” and this doesn’t require any special action/inaction on the part of liberals.

    If Obama is inclined to tack to the right, it’s not because of unreliable liberal voters, it’s because it’s what his political team wants to do and blaming liberals for being insufficiently supportive makes for a good excuse (also, slapping hippies is worth bonus points to VSP).

13. maha,
    “Yawn. I’m too old for this.”
    Don’t you dare quit on us! I’m suicidal enough as it is!!! 🙂

14. terry,
    Times have changed so much that, if you look at it, in some respects, Nixon was our last “Liberal” President – OSHA, Clean Air, COLA, he tried to get health care, tried a wage-price freeze, etc. I’m not saying he was a Liberal, by any stretch of the imagination. He wasn’t! It’s just that this country has moved so far right since Ike’s, JFK’s, and LBJ’s time (thanks to the greatest acting job a mediocre actor, and terrible President, ever did – Reagan, spit 3x’s, cross self, spit 3x’s again!), that Carter, Clinton, and now Obama, are, in some degree’s, and situations, to the right of Nixon. So, comparisons are tough. And please don’t remind me that Obama’s continuing some of “Little Boots’s” worst policies. There are things our first African-American President can do, and some he can’t. Any attack on us would be disasterous not only for the country, but for him, and the future of people of color who want to run for President. Maybe I’m just making excuses. I don’t know anymore..
    But, if we want a Liberal President, we’ll have to move the country in that direction. And right now may not seem like a good time, but, there’s no time like the present to start.

15. maha,

    I join gulag in his sentiments!!! I had so much hope in my ‘home boy’ and thought that he was as liberal as most people in our home state, Hawaii….I guess living on this side of the big pond too long has done him no good. And his dear mother was a social worker too, tsk, tsk. (yeah, retired sw here).

    I have to say that his remarks today really made my hopeful heart drop….but since I am getting adequate anti depressants, which is the reason why I can’t seem to paint anymore, I am going to try to hold on to the fantasy that he is planning and scheming a way to get us what the country needs and stick it to those woefully greedy, racist and uninformed blockheads that seem to think that they speak for Americans. I’m an Independent voter but I am going to change my status to Democrat so I can vote in the primaries from now on.

    I think that I am more mad than sad now. To be honest, the minute I saw who was chairing this little committee I knew we were lost…who is advising Obama?? He needs to fire them immediately! GRRRRRRRRR!!!!!! (don’t worry about me, I’ll be alright in a minute…must go meditate in my garden now).

16. I sent an Email to the WH. Not that it will be ‘read’ – but someone keeps a tally, I am sure. I reminded (not too gently) President Obama that he campaigned on fair taxes – which meant no increase under 250K – the top two percent. Without raising taxes on the top tier, Obama can’t even PRETEND he’s getting the budget under control. If he can’t remember and keep that promise (fair taxes for the rich)- I will ACTIVELY support a liberal candidate in the primaries – one who understands a pledge and will honor it.

17. Uhm, it’s almost Christmas. If someone’s written a book called “Politics for Dummies,” I’d suggest a gift for every Democratic politician in this country. And especially one for our President.

    Nod. I do get some of what he’s tried to do. With health care reform, I thought there was a brief moment where a few Republicans could turn dealmakers. And then, obstruction might be broken.

    But it failed. Obstruction wins the day.

    What bothers me isn’t so much the Republican engagement, though. What bothers me is how he starts off giving the Republicans what they could reasonably want. You want stimulus? Here, here’s a bunch of tax cuts. And then they instantly say it’s too much spending, not enough tax cutting. Why not? What do they have to lose?

    See, that’s not how you encourage engagement. You encourage engagement by *rewarding* it. By letting them have a few wins, but *only if they ask for them*. Then you encourage engagement.

    At the same time, it’s reasonable to expect adults in leadership positions to be reasonable, and to tell the truth, at least sometimes. From a realistic perspective, people should be viewing much of the Republican party as unruly brats.

18. moonbat – If health care benefits were taxable income, employees would be paying $126 billion/year more in income taxes.

    Much the same can be said of pensions. But they’re not considered taxable income because they’re an employee benefit that does not leave the employee in constructive receipt of the funds.

    Now, we can have the debate over whether health insurance should be an employee benefit, like a pension plan. But it drives me crazy when people speak of the tax-preferential treatment of health care plans without knowing the history.

    Money paid by businesses to compensate employees is considered a tax deductible cost of doing business. Non-cash benefits given to employees are frequently considered non-taxable, though what benefits could be considered non-taxable were cut back several times.

    The idea of taxing health insurance is actually much bigger than most people realize. It’s not a matter of “removing a subsidy” as some folks say – it’s either taxing a business for something that has a long history of being considered a necessary business expense, or of suddenly declaring that having health insurance is a fungible benefit, like a company car, even if you don’t use the insurance that year.

19. I was watching “Morning Joe” yesterday as this topic was batted about.
    My first thought was ‘WHAT A BUNCH OF HORSE SHIT!”, but then I started thinking Obama could be pulling a bit of political ju-jitsu; throwing up all these painful possibilities that the right suggests in the faces of the baby boomers who are now between 55 and 70. The beatings will continue until morale improves, we’ll beat you ’till you bleed, then beat you for bleedin’.
    I admit wanting to scream at the T.V. when Willy, Joe , and Mika suggested the common folk work into their 70’s. Like it’s too much to ask for a couple of years of play time to enjoy before one’s body gives out. Besides, they seem to overlook the possibility that employers may not want a geriatric work force that needs naps, forgets where they put shit, and needs an extra day off a week for dr. visits.It is expected that the older workers “retire” to make way for the next generation.
    My mom was pretty sharp mentally into her 80’s, but she went down hill real fast after taking a fall at 84.I might add that most of my friends are 10 to 20 years older than me, and they are having some serious health issues from cancer to osteo-arthritis. These conditions require life style changes and shifting of financial burdens, and I expect health care professionals to be the next target by the right in terms of them earning too much money, replacing teachers, auto workers, and the SEIU as the new scape goat.
    As far as killing the interest deduction on home loans goes, that will sink the real estate industry.Only the wealthy will be able to afford property, then we will return to those halcyon days of feudalism.We’ll all be serfin’.
    There’s an assignment for ya Gulag, a parody song “Serfin’ Safari”,Sing it with me!”Let’s go serfin’ now, everybody’s learning how, come on a safari with me……”

    I was working on Florida’s nature coast this week, from Weeki Wachee to the Withlacoochee River; lots of retired folks there.I picked up a local talk radio show; it seems that there is a large number of people in that area who think Obama is a Muslim/ communist, intent on installing Sharia law and destroying “America”.
    There are many signs along the road for buying gold, selling guns, and there seems to be a church on every corner. Charming place……………

    I was thinking that Obama should frame paying taxes as patriotic, even more patriotic than just “supporting the troops”, because “supporting the troops” currently means just thinking about them from time to time, pretty easy to do that.
    I suppose that would make him like Mao; poor bastard can’t get a break…..
    Better yet, I was thinking again about running away to New Zealand, but I need more money for that; they don’t want 56 year old guys with bad knees and no money in the bank.
    Any suggestions? ( besides STFU ?)

20. Mr. Hughes,

    Actively supporting a liberal candidate in the primaries sounds like a good idea. But who, besides Hillary, has the exposure (money) to mount a a nationwide campaign by next March?

    • But who, besides Hillary, has the exposure (money) to mount a a nationwide campaign by next March?

      The first task might be to draw up a list of genuinely liberal politicians, period.

21. erinyes,
    Yeah, I like that “Serfin’ Safari.” I did a different serfin’ BB song a few months ago.

    The one thing that no one’s asking, or I haven’t seen it asked, is: “If continuing these existing these tax cuts are needed to create jobs, why are they still needed? I mean, we’ve had them for 10 years, we should be drowning in jobs if that was the solution. How are they going to create jobs tomorrow that they haven’t done for over 3,600 yesterdays?”

    New Zealand sounds nice. But, I can afford to go today even less than yesterday. My unemployment check didn’t hit my bank this morning, so I’ll be spending all day on the phone trying to talk the a human being at the NY State Unemployment office. Cripes!!!

22. Cund: “If continuing these existing these tax cuts are needed to create jobs, why are they still needed? I mean, we’ve had them for 10 years, we should be drowning in jobs if that was the solution. How are they going to create jobs tomorrow that they haven’t done for over 3,600 yesterdays?”

    I’ve been asking that question in many comment threads and it’s never answered. Even conservative commenters at various NY Times’ blogs haven’t answered me. We know why… they can’t answer it. Because tax cuts have little relation to hiring. And the financial elites are intent on making us serfs.

23. PrupleGirl,
    Our MSM, with a handful of exceptions, is about as useful as mammaries on a male bovine…

24. Wellstone’s dead. Kennedy is too. Chris Dodd turned into a complete Whoreporatist, and badly tainted his brand in the last 2 years, besides, if he did run, he didn’t do so good in ’08 anyway. Feingold and Grayson didn’t get re-eected, but could run. Though neither will get much of a national following. Mario Cuomo’s too old.
    Who’s left?
    How about Al Franken? He’s a genuine Liberal. That’ll piss the right off. Though why a mediocre actor for President is ok, but a great comedian isn’t will be fodder for talk radio and TV gasbag hours for a long, long time.
    Anybody have any other suggestions?

    • Hey, I’d vote for Al Franken for president. I’d like to see him run if only to see what he’d do on the stump.

25. Oh, I LOVE Al!
    Your site, a few others, and Al’s, Rhandi’s and Sam Seder’s Air America shows kept me sane from 2004 on.
    If Al ran, I’d work as hard as possible to get him elected. He really is a brilliant man. But that isn’t exactly a great sales feature to the rest of the country, where dumb is the new smart, and dumber means you’re a Republican Presidential candidate.

26. cund and purple girl – It depends on whose taxes get cut. If the 98% of us who do the great bulk of consuming have more money in our pockets due to lower taxes, well consume – which accounts for about 60% of the overall economy.

    Whoever it was who purchased a Renoir in 1990, $78.1 million, the purchase put no jobs into the market. That kind of money stays in the top 2% of earners.

    It should also be taken into consideration that about 40% of us pay no income taxes at all – mostly because our earned income is so low. So that group has to be eliminated from the group of potential consumers.

    As an aside, this latest commission studying the sorry state of our economy should have started with and stayed with an in-depth study of the federal tax code. Like GE pays no income tax. Like Exxon Mobile pays no income tax? Like hedge-funders are taxed at 15%? I suggest that a revamping, how about throw the piece of shit out and start all over again, might just go a long way to “fixing’ our economy.

27. Maha,

    Genuinely liberal politicians. Liberal/progressive = very important.

    It is a mighty short list. Is there anyone holding elective office who is truly liberal, has name recognition and can raise the money?

Comments are closed.