Gun Culties vs. Everybody Else

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Obama Administration

Why we need gun control — a man who sheltered some Sandy Hook elementary students on the day of the mass shootings is being harassed by Sandy Hook truthers.

“I don’t know what to do,” sighed Gene Rosen. “I’m getting hang up calls, I’m getting some calls, I’m getting emails with, not direct threats, but accusations that I’m lying, that I’m a crisis actor, ‘how much am I being paid’?” Someone posted a photo of his house online. There have been phony Google+ and YouTube accounts created in his name, messages on white supremacist message boards ridiculing the “emotional Jewish guy,” and dozens of blog posts and videos “exposing” him as a fraud. One email purporting to be a business inquiry taunted: “How are all those little students doing? You know, the ones that showed up at your house after the ‘shooting’. What is the going rate for getting involved in a gov’t sponsored hoax anyway?”

On the day of the shooting, Mr. Rosen found six small children and a bus driver on his front lawn. The children said their teacher was dead. He took them in, talked to them, gave them snacks, and called their parents. He gave some interviews after, and the truther mob went after him.

Numerous YouTube videos have been upload that purport to ‘expose’ his ‘lies.’

One man, posting under the name Police State Radio, posted a 15-minute video in which he claimed at least one of the Sandy Hook victims was killed in Rosen’s basement.

‘She was sacrificed in the house, in gene’s house,’ the man says.

This mob is made up of the same people who think they must be allowed to carry concealed firearms anywhere they go and have unfettered access to military weapons. Oh, and in their minds they are “patriots” and “law abiding citizens” who believe they must be armed to defend themselves against “bad guys.”

The NRA likes to frame the gun rights debate in terms of “law-abiding citizens” versus “criminals.” And I’m saying it’s not the professional criminals who scare me. I’ve never in my life been threatened by a gun-toting mobster. But I’ve had a few run-ins with armed hotheads who considered themselves to be “law-abiding citizens” and in fact probably did not have criminal records. But they also lacked heads that were screwed on all the way or as much sense as God gave pop tarts.

There are news stories saying that the President is poised to move forward on a comprehensive gun control package. The package could include some executive orders, which could include such measures as actually prosecuting people who lie on their background checks. Naturally, the usual whackjobs think this is tyranny and want President Obama impeached.

Polls show that support for and opposition to gun control falls along demographic lines; basically, we’re looking at middle-aged and older white men without college degrees versus almost everybody else. Groups most supportive of gun control include younger people of all races, college-educated women, and racial minorities. Josh Marshall prints a letter from a reader –

I view gun control from the prism of the gender wars. It’s a last-gasp attempt by lower-income men to hold onto some shred of self-respect: at least a capacity for autonomous violence, if they are left with nothing else.

And they are being left with nothing else, since the job market is increasingly feminized on all but the highest levels, most remaining male-gendered work (except uniformed public service) is increasingly losing income and status, and patriarchy is no longer a particularly strong legal or cultural norm. This is responsible for many things: almost all bad. I call it the Scots-Irishization of lower-income white men.

If it’s respect they want, they might want to stop acting like a pack of rabid hyenas, or buggier than road kill in August.

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23 Comments

22 Comments

  1. joanr16  •  Jan 15, 2013 @3:57 pm

    What. A. Freakshow. Honestly, if all these fetishists wanted was unfettered access to all-cupcakes-all-the-time, we wouldn’t have a problem. Enjoy your cupcakes, folks, and your diabetes.

    But when they start flipping out over stuff like this Rosen story, or defend the spittle of that tattooed skinhead a few threads down (I love how the creepy troll defended him after the skinhead himself had apologized, at least for the death threats), I realize there’s a reason they want all-guns-all-the-time: they’re overflowing with hate and rage, and they want to hurt everyone they possibly can.

    And it wasn’t Newtown that led me to this radical conclusion; it was the gun-fetishists’ response to Newtown. Batsh*t and evil, the lot of them.

  2. maha  •  Jan 15, 2013 @4:11 pm

    And it wasn’t Newtown that led me to this radical conclusion; it was the gun-fetishists’ response to Newtown. Batsh*t and evil, the lot of them.

    And in their minds, they’re the “good guys.” That makes them even more dangerous.

  3. Bonnie  •  Jan 15, 2013 @5:01 pm

    The reasons these guys give for being against gun control is about overthrowing the government. That is treason.

  4. c u n d gulag  •  Jan 15, 2013 @5:03 pm

    Guns, and being armed all of the time – the new “White Man’s Burden.”

    Them thar shootn arns, and the right to own and shoot ‘em, may the one thing some white men in this country feel that they still have.

    There’s a Nigra in the White House.
    A Nigra that beat a war hero (yeah, I know…) ‘n a white woman the last time – ‘n a rich ol’ white dude ‘n a rich young white dude this time.
    And a Nigra is Attorney General.

    Nigra’s ‘n Messicans done took their jobs.
    Nigra’s ‘n other brown people can go ‘n get educations, run for office, become doctors and lawyers, ‘n they can marry WHITE men, and WHITE WOMEN!

    And this is it, ‘the right to bear arms,’ where the pasty white man has decided to make his “last stand!”
    “Custard’s Last Stand!”

    These people are nuttier than a Planters canning factory.

  5. JR  •  Jan 15, 2013 @5:07 pm

    These are also the people that boo’d gay soldiers and chanted that sick people who can’t afford insurance and treatment should die. It’s amazing how they revel in their meanness.

  6. joanr16  •  Jan 15, 2013 @5:23 pm

    Just for fun, over on the CNN website I clicky-ed on the instant poll question: “Should background checks be required for private gun sales and sales at gun shows.” Current result: 87% YES, 11% NO (not sure where the other 2% went, between just two answers; into Wolf Blitzer’s beard, I suspect).

    My instinct is that the deranged gun fetishist community really does represent 10% or less of the overall population. It probably helps to remember that, first, even among American gun owners, the deranged fetishists don’t comprise 100%, and therefore they aren’t the only ones in the population who possess firearms. Second, in the event of an uprising of deranged fetishists, the police and the military would step in to protect the reasonable 90% of the population, and would squash the fetishists flat.

    And if that were to happen, after culling the deranged 10% we could start afresh, with reasonable, federal gun laws.

  7. fang  •  Jan 15, 2013 @5:34 pm

    @Joanr16

    Some of the gun fetishists I’ve read think the police and military will join them. They miss, rather conveniently, a few things:
    1) If they “start the revolution” that means breaking laws and killing people. That doesn’t go over well.
    2) Even if they have sympathizers, they won’t have enough influence to avoid the hammer coming down.
    3) The military especially is very well armed.

    Right now what’s not often apparent is the Gun Fetishists are on a downward spiral. There will be more laws and regulations and pressure against them. If they fight back with guns, there will be only more pressure. I think we’re about at the stage where they’ll freak out – and ironically increase gun regulation.

  8. joanr16  •  Jan 15, 2013 @5:53 pm

    Fang, I completely agree that the GFs (I really need to abbreviate that) misjudge the overwhelming majority of cops and military, for the exact reasons you mention. I recall that law enforcement all over the U.S. has been vehemently opposed to the NRA’s concealed-carry juggernaut, for instance.

    I also agree the GFs are on a downward spiral. I don’t want to see violence, but faced with the current degree of derangement, I’m afraid it may be inevitable. And if it starts in my neighborhood, I’ll have only knitting needles and a couple saucepans with which to defend myself, so I’m afraid the end result will be “Nice knowin’ y’all.”

    Hmm, am I the only one reminded of the movie 28 Days Later, and the plague of Rage? (Except the military was not helpful there….)

  9. Swami  •  Jan 15, 2013 @6:04 pm

    (I love how the creepy troll defended him after the skinhead himself had apologized, at least for the death threats),

    You mean?… Don’t tread on America. :)

    Fantasy isn’t always a bad thing. It does serve a purpose as a protection mechanism to prevent emotional overload. Many times i’ve had to retreat into fantasy to prevent frying my motherboard.

  10. Swami  •  Jan 15, 2013 @7:46 pm

    joanr16 …Tape a picture of Ronny Reagan on your door post and the angel of freedom will pass over.

  11. Bill Bush  •  Jan 15, 2013 @9:03 pm

    When “truther” is an ironic reference to coordinated groups of liars, you know we have gone over at least one kind of cliff.

  12. Doug  •  Jan 15, 2013 @10:45 pm

    OT – but a hoot! http://politicker.com/2013/01/satanists-rally-for-rick-scott/

    Top comment : “With friends like this, who needs democrats?”

  13. justme277  •  Jan 16, 2013 @3:49 am

    I read a piece from the Washington Post called “How the nra’s true believers converted a marksmanship group into a mighty gun lobby” That kinda relates to this.

    As I read this I kept seeing numbers the nra bragged about, either the number of new members that they saw around events like Sandy Hook or numbers that reflected their total membership. They know who all of their members are currently and they have a big fat list. They have a seat at the table lobbying congress – MY member- YOUR member. Call your member of Congress to lobby their support on an issue, they don’t give a flying shit what you have to say, but when the nra calls it’s total accommodation. They have a voice with your elected official that YOU don’t have. That any group be it grocers or gun toters have a voice over the individual constituent HAS to change.As tweety said tonite the GOP has come to mean GUNS OVER PEOPLE and it has become the perfect example of why it MUST stop.

    And lets chat about that list, shall we? If these folks have a voice I don’t have , we the people have a right to know the NAMES of every member behind the organization. And that goes for any group who lobbies one of our paid representatives. The tax payers are not paying these bums on the public dole for life to be shrills for any organization , they are being paid to serve the residents of their states. THIS is the perfect example of what goes wrong.

    So with that list in mind I have heard a lot of talk about how we could never locate all the guns, blah blah blah..ahhhh well we have the names and current addresses for “millions” of them according to the nra in their database. Now stick with me here because, this could be something: Just stopping NEW nut jobs from getting guns is a great place to start but the blah blah blah crowd may be right- so lets kick it up a notch. The NSA can have my e mails and all my( or anyones) phone calls, data, ect ( thanks gw, you giant douche) ..hell if they want to know they can probably be certain if we are getting enough fiber in our diets. They can search our homes without a warrant or without ever even telling us, SO there is no excuse for them NOT to have that list too. Especially if the nra wants a voice with elected officials. AND this would give access to local, state and federal officials who could cross check names in a data base, ect.. Most of these gun folks want to fly their freak flag under the radar,, and if they thought the nra was a way for the government to i.d them they would drop out by the droves..thus ending the support and power and leaving behind the yeager type nuts too stupid to shut up. …Look , thanks to bush not one person can even have a private reading list at the library so why the hell does this group get rights we don’t? They have a right to peacefully assemble but the law has a right to know who they are. Go to the superbowl and undergo face recognition software. Go to some airports and enjoy the full body scan ( ask for 8×10 glossies of the image, that annoys em). No need to ask the nra, just storm the place and take them. Now that certain members have made valid threats against the government the NSA should be able to access their data too..they can do it to people who have done nothing. I think the general public has a right to the names of all of their members but at least police at the state and federal level should know who they might be dealing with. Hell lets match it up with the most wanted data base and the terrorist list and see if there is any match with a current address…hmmmm.Lets run checks on these members and pay the ones with no legal right to even own guns a visit.

    You have a right to own a gun and be an nra member but there is no constitutional right to no one knowing. Listen here, the old southern saying about the best way to deal with a cockroach is shine a light on em! holds some truth.. turns out they just don’t like it.

    I believe it would be an effective cure for this nations nra problem. I really do believe that if their membership became part of a federal data base they would get very few new members, life members would quit(like bush sr did years ago) , regular members would quit and their money would dry up( along with their voice and power)..

    As for the “truthers” they wouldn’t know truth if it bit them in their asses. For shame that ANYONE in Newtown would be harassed at a time like this, much less someone who jut tried to help.

    As for impeachment, and this idiot rand paul and his “king” crap, well it certainly pleased him to hear what rolled out of his mouth, so nice to see he amuses himself but both bush sr and their god reagan passed executive orders and no one suggested impeaching the king then..We should start a pool. How many articles of impeachment will they draw in the next four years? Can we just defund their pen and paper budget? We got two ready for the drawing now, and he has not even started his second term officially. Are we having fun yet?

  14. joanr16  •  Jan 16, 2013 @9:43 am

    Doug – Satanists love Rick Scott because… Voldemort.

  15. Brent  •  Jan 16, 2013 @1:17 pm

    I live just a few minutes’ drive away from Sandy Hook Elementary School. While I knew no one directly affected, I have met a number of people who were — a close friend of one of the teachers killed, parents of kids at the school who were safe (but whose kids are traumatized), and others.

    The people who believe that this event was a conspiracy of government are truly scary, and are the last people who should be trusted with sharp scissors much less firearms. It is truly appalling that such people have any effect on the national debate over what to do about this, and far too many similar, tragedies.

    I am a middle-aged white male (though college educated and successful in my career), but I would heartily agree with the characterization of gun fetishists as the ill-educated whites attempting to cling to some sort of external substitute for the emasculation they feel as a lifetime of bad choices begin to catch up to them and they realize that not only will things not get much better in their lives, but that things are only going to get worse, due to forces that they can’t control (demographics, the economy, etc.).

  16. Katechon  •  Jan 16, 2013 @2:15 pm

    Alex Jones and the truther brigades are nutso, crazies; and they are NOT conservatives.

    But this blogger *maha* of The Mahablog conflates grossly the people of the Midland, the rednecks, with those crazy truthers, those conspiracy freaks.

    This [truther] mob is made up of the same people who think they must be allowed to carry concealed firearms anywhere they go and have unfettered access to military weapons. Oh, and in their minds they are “patriots” and “law abiding citizens” who believe they must be armed to defend themselves against “bad guys.” [emphasis mine]

    The rednecks of the Midland, and other kind of Tea Partiers, do not coincide with the truther brigades and their conspiracy theories. It’s true that they are generally white folks without college degree, and more male than female; but the similarity ends there.

    Am I alone in growing uncomfortable with this forked-tongue diabolization of the gun-clinging, Bible-toting white folks (mostly) whithout college degree that (mostly) inhabit the Midland?

    Blogger *maha* says the following, not only of the crazy truthers but also of the good, peaceful, law-abiding, gun-clinging rednecks:

    [T[hey also lacked heads that were screwed on all the way or as much sense as God gave pop tarts.

    And joanr16 says the following in the comment section...

    [T]hey’re overflowing with hate and rage, and they want to hurt everyone they possibly can. [...] Batsh*t and evil, the lot of them.
    – joanr16

    …to which blogger *maha* replies, in agreement:

    And in their minds, they’re the “good guys.” That makes them even more dangerous.

    My God. They seem to be doing to white folks what the Third Reich did to the Jews prior to the massacre: diabolize them (“they want to hurt everybody”, they are “evil,” they are “stupid.”)

    When those haters do not conflate the law-abiding rednecks with crazy truthers, they focus their dark hatred on the representatives of the Second Amendment, especially Wayne LaPierre. We had crusty, nutsy members of the academia GROSSLY conflating the NRA with actual killers, I kid you not: Erik Loomis wrote the following, in the middle of the affective storm following the Newton massacre: “Looks like the National Rifle Association has murdered some more children.” Loomis also threw bloody metaphors like “I want Wayne LaPierre’s head on a stick,” Dracula-style.

    And now we have a videogame where hostile keyboard demagogues à la Loomis can target LaPierre (and by proxy, the gun-clinging rednecks he kinda represents) and shoot him with the effect of mildly realistic blood and gore.

    They’re diabolizing the rednecks by way of gross conflations, and actively nurturing and amplifiying an anti-Christian, anti-white, anti-redneck affect. It looks increasingly like those unnuanced, seemingly blood-thirsty, haters are not actually against The Gun, but rather against the rednecks, the glorious people of the Midland.

  17. c u n d gulag  •  Jan 16, 2013 @3:07 pm

    Katechon,
    Well, considering you’re talking to people who, when we spoke out against the wars and occupations in Afghanistan and, especially Iraq, were demonized as treasonous traitors, who should at best be rounded up, and at worst, then shot.

    And when we spoke out against torture, we were told that WE should be the ones being tortured.

    And when we questioned the wisdom of keeping tax cuts for the richest, while waging 2 wars and occupations, and giving a big gift to Big Pharma, we were told we don’t understand how supply-side economics works, because we’re obiously SocialistFascistCommunists, and probably treasonous traitors, to boot.

    So, for years, all I heard was, “How dare you vermin question Glorious Leader George W. Bush?”

    So, you see, your analogy of the Nazi’s and Jews is a bad one.
    You see, WE’RE (the Liberals) the Jews in this story – and have been since the first DFH decided he’d rather make love, than go over to Vietnam and fight in a war that had nothing to do with us, and only to do with the people and companies who could profit from “The Domino Theory.”

    And, having lived down South for almost a decade, you can keep your rednecks and glorious people of the Midland – and I’ll take my non-redneck, Liberal Hell-hole non-Midland NY State folks (you know, the state which funds a lot of the states in the South and Midland), thank you very, very much.

  18. c u n d gulag  •  Jan 16, 2013 @3:08 pm

    Oh, and I almost forgot – “Muslim-lovers.”
    Yeah, I heard that one a lot.

  19. joanr16  •  Jan 16, 2013 @3:51 pm

    Mr. Troll, I live in Nebraska. Have done 55 years. I think our comments hit too close to home to you, alas, which is why you misrepresent those comments so utterly.

    I grew up with guns. I remember the NRA when it represented sporting people and not manufacturers and psychotics. I remember when Republicans weren’t complete idiots. It was the NRA, idiots, and Republicans who changed my views.

    And you might check your facts on the shooter game, as it sounds an awful lot like one prominent in the news these days, which originated with the NRA. Take a few facts, and flip them around; unfortunately for you, that’s not succeeding like it used to. The reality remains: we are not the ones who get off on shooting at people we disagree with; we are deploring the people who do that.

    Oh, and if you don’t want people to think you’re creepy, you might change your avatar photo.

  20. erinyes  •  Jan 16, 2013 @7:38 pm

    Katcheon, my boy;back your truck up and review the whole issue and things will be easier to understand.And Joanie is right about your gravitar, son;you look like a dick in that photo. The first rule about wanting to be taken seriously is to look sane.

  21. Doug  •  Jan 17, 2013 @10:24 pm

    Here’s a must-read for anyone (like me) who couldn’t figure out why the 2nd amendment is so ambiguous. What’s with the ‘militia’ phrase if the purpose is simply to uphold an individuals right to keep a gun or guns? There is evidence including direct quotes from the founding fathers on the subject.

    The ‘militias’ were the slave patrols organized in and sometimes by the southern states to prevent a slave rebellion. The southern states were concerned that abolitionist states could use the power of the federal government to disband the slave patrols that kept the slaves in their place. (frightened and docile)

    I’m not inclined to adopt the opinions of a historian, but the direct quotes from the period make the argument quite compelling.

    http://truth-out.org/news/item/13890-the-second-amendment-was-ratified-to-preserve-slavery

  22. Doug  •  Jan 17, 2013 @11:02 pm

    Katechon – I guess the word of the day is ‘conflate’. You seem offended that we aren’t doing a good job of differentiating between the heroic gun-toting citizens of the midland from the truthers and right-wing kooks you disavow. Actally, as a gun owner, I’ve spoken a lot about effective vs invasive gun control.

    Which brings me back to the word of the day. Have you argued against the conflation of the phrase ‘gun control’ with the concept of ‘gun confiscation’. Nothing that has been proposed by this administration – or anyone in Congress has proposed confiscation – or anything that looks like confiscation. Yet for years, the NRA and the various gun publications have touted the threat of confiscation to the point where the mere mention of ‘gun control’ has the heartland in a panic over a threat that doesn’t exist.

    Last, *Maha* is a Buddhist. I’ve been a regular for many years here on her blog. She doesn’t do ‘anti-christian’ nor does she tolerate religion-bashing. She does look critically at the fringe groups who would make public policy conform to their religious views. That’s a violation of constitutional law and the ethical beliefs of the founding fathers. Voicing opposition to the tyranny of religion is not ‘anti-christian’. If you do a little research on Mahablog, you owe someone a retraction and apology for a false and insulting accusation. (You can disagree over guns – no sweat.)

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